Re: A tent for all theists? Was :RE: Moon proclaims he is

From: Robert Schneider (
Date: Mon Jul 15 2002 - 14:01:40 EDT

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    I would not lump Dawkins and Eugenie Scott together. While Scott professes
    to be agnostic, she is not hostile toward religion, and has urged members of
    the religious community who support evolution as science to say so
    publically. The National Center for Science Education, which Genie is exec.
    director, includes a Faith Network Project, currently under the direction of
    the Rev. Phina Borgeson, an Episcopal deacon and a member of the board of
    the Episcopal Church Network for Science, Technology and Faith. I met Genie
    at an AAAS DoSER meeting in Washington two years ago, in which
    representative of several faith communities met for consultation on how
    people of faith through their denominational organization could defend the
    teaching of evolution (not evolutionism) in public schools.

    Bob Schneider

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Shuan Rose" <>
    To: "george murphy" <>; "Glenn Morton"
    Cc: <>
    Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 11:36 AM
    Subject: ID: A tent for all theists? Was :RE: Moon proclaims he is

    > messiah! Impact on ID?
    > Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:03:08 -0400
    > Sender:
    > Precedence: bulk
    > Presumably ID is supposed to be a big tent uniting theists (all of whom
    > believe that God is the creator?/designer? against antireligious
    > evolutionists, like Dawkins, Dennett, Provine etc. Yet it has not worked
    > that way, with many religious thinkers attacking ID. Why? Are'nt Phillip,
    > Jonathon et al. on our side , fighting against the forces of darkness, led
    > by the Lord of Hellfire himself, Dawkins? (OK, maybe he isn't THE Lord of
    > Hellfire, but IMO he may be one of his minions :-)
    > Well, Glenn, George? Do you think you are giving aid and comfort to the
    > enemy by "lining up" with , say, Dawkins & Eugene Scott against defenders
    > theism like Phillip Johnson and Jonathon Wells.? Even if they are wrong
    > about a few technical and theological issues, shouldn't we being lining up

    > with them ?
    > -----Original Message-----
    > From: []On
    > Behalf Of george murphy
    > Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2002 7:37 PM
    > To: Glenn Morton
    > Cc:
    > Subject: Re: Moon proclaims he is messiah! Impact on ID?
    > I sent my earlier post before looking at the item Glenn refers
    > below. Having done so, I can heartily recommend it as the funniest
    > religious
    > news item I've seen in many years. Note especially the following:
    > "At the celestial event, Muhammed is said to have led three
    > while God submitted a letter stating, 'I believe in the True Parents.'"
    > Just try to picture it. Words fail me.
    > George
    > Glenn Morton wrote:
    > > In a move which surely must cause a bit of embarrassment for the ID
    > group,
    > > Phil Johnson and other ID members, Rev. Sun Myung Moon has proclaimed
    > "that
    > > Jesus, Muhammad, Buddha - even God - have told him he is now 'the
    > > Messiah and King of Kings of all of humanity!'"
    > >
    > >
    > > This may have some impact on the ID movement but to explain why
    > > some background.
    > >
    > > Keith Miller, in Dec. 1999 published a note with Jonathan Well's web
    > papers
    > > proclaiming that he was a Moonie. Keith attached a note from Phillip
    > Johnson
    > > at the bottom. Johnson acknowledges that he knew Wells is a Moonie
    > > frankly expresses a big yawn for that knowledge. I posted a response
    > > Keith's note outlining what I viewed as the ID movement's lack of
    > > for Scriptural Christianity.
    > >
    > >
    > > I also had been having an e-mail conversations with Paul Nelson just
    > > before Keith's note. Paul had already confirmed to me that Wells was a
    > > Moonie and a fine fellow. He said that they merely disagreed about
    > theology.
    > > I should hope so! But at what point do our attempts to create an
    > apologetic
    > > become worthless for our faith?
    > >
    > > I think the question for the evangelical supporters of the ID movement
    > and
    > > the Discovery Institute is: Should we support someone with views like
    > this?
    > > Will Nelson and colleagues like Steve Meyer, in light of Moon's
    > > proclamation that he is the 'King of King for all humanity!" continue
    > > encourage evangelical publishers to publish Well's stuff? Wells who
    > must
    > > believe that Sun Myung Moon is the Messiah seems to hold values quite
    > > odds with conventional Christianity. It seems to me that ID has
    > so
    > > theologically neutral as to be of no value to Christianity.
    > >
    > > glenn
    > >
    > > see
    > > for lots of creation/evolution information
    > > anthropology/geology/paleontology/theology\
    > > personal stories of struggle

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